Agathon is portrayed by Plato as a handsome young man, well dressed, of polished manners, courted by the fashion, wealth and wisdom of Athens, and dispensing hospitality with ease and refinement. ( Log Out /  Socrates is also present, as is Alcibiades, the notorious Athenian politician and general who played such a prominent role in the Peloponnesian War. Pausanias est cité plus brièvement dans un autre dialogue socratique, Le Banquet de Xénophon (en VIII, 32-34) : Socrate y critique l'éloge de la pédérastie grecque faite par Pausanias[note 1]. Thus, love itself cannot be as perfect as Agathon says it is. Pausanias was a legal professional and Eryximachus was a physician. This ensures that sufficient time will elapse so that the loved one can test his lover's mettle. The history of Agathon, Pausanias and Euripides may remind us that, in the continuing debate about the norms of Greek pederasty, the experience of long lived relationships was not unknown. Socrates is also present, as is Alcibiades, the notorious Athenian politician and general who played such a prominent role in the Peloponnesian War. Pausanias d'Athènes (en grec ancien Παυσανίας, actif autour de 420 av. Pausanias (not Pausanius) and Agathon are important because they are taken to show that it was possible for two men to be in a long-term faithful relationship. On sait par ailleurs qu'Agathon s'attira les moqueries du dramaturge Aristophane qui le caricature dans sa comédie Les Thesmophories sous les traits d'un homme efféminé qui se travestit et pratique une homosexualité passive[4]. Pausanias d'Athènes (en grec ancien Παυσανίας, actif autour de 420 av. Ancient anecdotes tend to address only his relationship with Agathon and give us no information about his personal accomplishments. Recall that Erixymachus is a doctor, and is a follower… Reflecting on sexuality around the Church of England Shared Conversations. It was in his house that the Dinner Party of Plato's Symposium takes place. In his speech Agathon takes an approach similar to that of Phaedrus, focusing on love's attributes as a divine being (i.e., the god Eros). Agathon was the lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato's Protagoras. Although Pausanias is given a significant speaking part in Plato's Symposium, very little is known about him.Ancient anecdotes tend to address only his relationship with Agathon and give us no information about his personal accomplishments. SCENE: The House of Agathon. Dans le Protagoras, Pausanias et Agathon sont installés côte à côte, près du lit du sophiste Prodicos de Céos. Ancient categories weren’t the same as ours and ‘in a faithful same sex relationship’ simply can’t be applied. Agathon was the son of Tisamenus, and the lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato's Protagoras. I’ve discussed elsewhere the range of different forms of behaviour that were around in the classical Greek world and which modern readers have too readily assimilated to ‘homosexuality’: an inappropriate amount of interest in personal grooming (seen, by the ancient Greeks, as indicating far too much interest in appearing attractive to women); temporary relationships in which one man (the erastês) was older and dominant with his partner (the erômenos) being younger and passive; male friendship with a strong spiritual bond but no physical expression; and men who preferred to dress and act in a way seen as ‘feminine’. The thoughts/responses offered are a resource from the (elected members of) the Committee to help reflection on the likely issues and questions.”. Both Pausanias and Agathon are present, as is the playwright Aristophanes. At the party, when all the initial participants had arrived, where Phaedrus, Pausanias, Aristophanes, Eryximachus, Agathon, and Socrates. On the Symposium . Thinking Anglicans notes that the Evangelical Group of the General Synod, EGGS, has issued this briefing document to its members and friends ahead of General Synod’s shared conversations, scheduled to start on 10 July. Agathon & Socrates’ speeches in Symposium Symposium is a series of speeches on Love, made by the guests, Socrates, Phaedrus, Pausanias, Eryximachus, Aristophanes and Alcibiades and their host, the young Agathon. Agathon introduced certain innovations into the Greek theater: Aristotle tells us in the Poetics (1456a) that the characters and plot of his Anthoswere original and not, following Athenian dramatic orthodoxy, borrowe… Pausanias, ( Flourished circa 420 BCE) an Athenian of the deme Kerameis, and was the lover of the poet Agathon.. Aux époques postérieures, Pausanias est cité dans Les Deipnosophistes d'Athénée (au livre V) et dans l’Histoire variée d'Élien (livre II). Pausanias est mentionné dans plusieurs textes grecs antiques. Pausanias est mentionné dans plusieurs textes grecs antiques. Aristophane believes love developed from a myth and that love can work against us. Love, he claims, is not the oldest of the gods—as Phaedrus had implied—but the youngest and most beautiful, with the ability to change shape at will. J.-C. Biographie [ modifier | modifier le code ] Fils de Tisamène, il vécut à Athènes de 450 ou 445 à 405 av. By doing that the couple … But was this like a modern ‘faithful same sex relationship’? J.-C., un Athénien du dème Kerameis[1], amant du poète Agathon. Enter your email address to follow this blog and receive notifications of new posts by email. Art Elysées du 17 au 21 Octobre Stand 506E Galerie Perahia Ma sculpture « … Pausanias en athenienser fra Deme Kerameis, var elsker til tragediedigteren Agathon. Although Pausanias is given a significant speaking part in Plato's Symposium, very little is known about him.Ancient anecdotes tend to address only his relationship with Agathon and give us no information about his personal accomplishments. Thus, love itself cannot be as perfect as Agathon says it is. Diogenes Laertius (Life of Plato 32) quotes a verse attributed to Plato about kissing Agathon and feeling his soul was trying to pass across to the other man, but this is included in a range of other lines attributed to Plato about both men and women he loved, and from its verse form appears to have been written after Plato’s death. The section of the document I have in mind is a potential response to someone expressing the view that ‘Scripture isn’t clear on a number of issues regarding human sexuality’ and it goes like this: “Some have suggested that faithful same sex relationships were not known in (pre) biblical times and therefore the bible is silent on this matter. I think not. In brief, Agathon finds himself forced to admit that love is a kind of desire, and something can be desired only if it is missing. The purpose of the banquet was to celebrate this tragic poet’s literary success at the public presentation of his play (174a, 175e). So the argument being made is that those who say the Bible doesn’t mention ‘faithful same sex relationships’ because they didn’t exist are wrong: such relationships did exist, so if the Bible had wanted to mention them, it could have done. Il apparaît principalement dans deux dialogues de Platon, le Protagoras et Le Banquet. Eryximachus, Agathon, and Socrates give speeches about how love pervades all things and form a trio in contrast to Phaedrus, Pausanias, and Aristophanes. c. 420 BC) was an ancient Athenian of the deme Kerameis, and was the lover of the poet Agathon. Agathon … In “The Frogs” (405 BC) Aristophanes had the god Dionysus proclaim Agathon “a good poet”, sorely missed by his fellow Athenians. All the speakers do not agree on the definition and features of love. When it’s his turn to speak, Pausanias contrasts the bad sort of love, only interested in the body, with the good sort, attracted to the soul. Pausanias believes there are two kinds of love, common love from Common Aphrodite and Heavenly love from Aphrodite, Daughter of Uranus. Agathon was the younger and he shaved his body to keep the look of still being a youth in spite of his middle-age. But I’ve a deeper concern, and that regards something I’ve commented on already in this blog: the use of the ancient Greeks without any sense of historical context. J.-C. environ, mais aucune de ses pièces n'a été conservée et on ne le connait qu'à travers les récits de ses contemporains. All the speakers do not agree on the definition and features of love. Pausanias, ( Flourished circa 420 BCE) an Athenian of the deme Kerameis, and was the lover of the poet Agathon.. info)) is the name of several people:. It seems that they remained together for several years. Agathon was also the first playwright to write choral parts which were apparently independent from the main plot of his plays.

Agathon is portrayed by Plato as a handsome young man, well dressed, of polished manners, courted by the fashion, wealth and wisdom of Athens, and dispensing hospitality with ease and refinement. Xénophon confond le discours de Pausanias avec celui de Phèdre dans. Agathon was the lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato's Protagoras. He, like all other participants of the Symposium, is a distinguished gentleman among Athenian aristocracy. Love, he claims, is not the oldest of the gods—as Phaedrus had implied—but the youngest and most beautiful, with the ability to change shape at will. Agathon est alors un meirakion (classe d'âge désignant les jeunes hommes âgés d'entre 14 et 21 ans environ) et il est présenté comme étant le paidika (aimé) de Pausanias . Agathon was the son of Tisamenus, and the lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato's Protagoras. The tone of Pausanias’ speech is self-serving and self-righteous, such as his attitude when discussing public law and his views on specific good acts to be virtuous. Socrates stays awake trying to persuade them that the same man must be know comedy and tragedy, that a tragic poet must necessarily also be a comic poet. Pausanias d'Athènes (en grec ancien Παυσανίας, actif autour de 420 av. Free library of english study presentation. Pausanias, Athénien amant du poète Agathon apparaissant dans plusieurs dialogues de Platon ;; Pausanias (-469 av. The term ‘(pre) biblical times’ makes no sense to me; I wonder if they meant ‘pre-New Testament times’. Authorpædia Trademarks Social buttons. Pausanias believes there are two kinds of love, common love from Common Aphrodite and Heavenly love from Aphrodite, Daughter of Uranus. Pausanias (/ p ɔː ˈ s eɪ n i ə s /; Greek: Παυσανίας; fl. Change ), You are commenting using your Twitter account. Pingback: Sexuality and the body: using ancient sources to support modern ideas, Pingback: Sexuality and the body: using ancient sources to support modern ideas | MotionBump Reader. Aelian (2.21) and Xenophon (Symposium 8.32) refer to them as erastês and erômenos. In his speech, he distinguishes between “common” and “heavenly” love, arguing that the latter is felt between lovers and their boyfriends, especially when these relationships are focused on the development of virtue. It is in his thoughts that he best distinguishes himself in his praise of honor, virtue, and courage. Also resident here was the poet Euripides, who himself had an erotic interest in Agathon (though by this time Agathon was aged 40 … Post was not sent - check your email addresses! Agathon d'Athènes (en grec ancien : Ἀγάθων / Agáthôn) est un poète tragique grec de la fin du V e siècle av. Erixymachus, appropriately, praises Eros as the superiority of the medical art, over and above the legal craftsmanship of Pausanias. Pausanias est mentionné dans plusieurs textes grecs antiques. We simply can’t say. I’m not denying that Pausanias and Agathon were used in the ancient world as an example of a relationship which went on for much longer than the erastês and erômenos type normally did. Start studying Plato's 'Symposium' quotes. It’s not a separate example from EGGS’ comment on ‘Plato and others’. Pausanias appears in the dialectic as one of the most generic though equally noble characters. The great comic playwright Aristophanes was also present at the banquet. No women are in the room, because the only woman who was there – a flute-girl – has been asked to leave. In 407 BC, Agathon and Pausanias accepted an invitation from Archelaus I of Macedon to visit his court at Pella, where Euripides and other artists had gone to escape the instability of Athens during the final phase of the Peloponnesian War. Plus loin dans le dialogue, le dramaturge Aristophane, qui intervient également dans le dialogue, fait une allusion peut-être moqueuse aux deux hommes[7]. I’ll concentrate here on the claim about Pausanias (not Pausanius) and Agathon. Share and download educational presentations online. The tone of Pausanias’ speech is self-serving and self-righteous, such as his attitude when discussing public law and his views on specific good acts to be virtuous. Tools Upload a file Advanced Search Newsletters Subscribe to Authorpædia. After, everyone drinks into the night and falls asleep, leaving just Socrates Agathon and Aristophanes. Symposium is a series of speeches on Love, made by the guests, Socrates, Phaedrus, Pausanias, Eryximachus, Aristophanes and Alcibiades and their host, the young Agathon. Summarize Phaedrus’s, Pausanias’, Eryximachus, Aristophanes’, and Agathon’s view on the nature of love in Plato’s Symposium.Be clear and complete as to the essentials of each view. Agathon’s speech is indissociable from that of Pausanias, for Agathon uses his praise of Eros to place implicitly himself on stage, by presenting the qualities he attributes to Eros as those that he himself so obviously possesses. Au cours du dialogue, Pausanias est le deuxième, après Phèdre, à prononcer un discours sur Éros (de 180c à 185c); il y distingue notamment deux Aphrodites, l'une commune et l'autre céleste (180d-181a). Eryximachus, Agathon, and Socrates give speeches about how love pervades all things and form a trio in contrast to Phaedrus, Pausanias, and Aristophanes. Change ). The host of the banquet was Agathon, a tragic playwright. No women are in the room, because the only woman who was there – a flute-girl – has been asked to leave. Agathon was the lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato's Protagoras. ( Log Out /  The document proposes that “The ideas/opinions/statements expressed (in bold) are amongst those that members might hear articulated and which we believe can (and need) to be responded to. Agathon was the son of Tisamenus, and the lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato's Protagoras. In brief, Agathon finds himself forced to admit that love is a kind of desire, and something can be desired only if it is missing. Agathon and Phaedrus believe love is a god. J.-C.), roi de Sparte ;; Pausanias, (-393 av. ( Log Out /  His boyfriend was Pausanias and they had a 10-15 years long relationship. Nouvelles oeuvres visibles actuellement à la galerie Pérahia! No women are in the room, because the only woman who was there – a flute-girl – has been asked to leave. Above all he is exquisitely polite, civilized, and well-mannered”, writes Blanckenhagen (60). Pheadrus focused on the virtue of bravery and Pausanias focused on Justice, one of the four cardinal virtues that Agathon references in speaking about the moral character of love in his speech. In 407 BC, Agathon and Pausanias accepted an invitation from Archelaus I of Macedon to visit his court at Pella, where Euripides and other artists had gone to escape the instability of Athens during the final phase of the Peloponnesian War. Together with Pausanias, he later moved to the court of Archelaus , king of Macedon , who was recruiting playwrights; it is … Le dialogue de Platon où Pausanias apparaît le plus longuement est Le Banquet, dont l'action se déroule en 416 au moment d'une victoire d'Agathon à un concours dramatique organisé à l'occasion des Lénéennes[5]. Not logged in | Create account | Login. Together with Pausanias, he later moved to the court of Archelaus , king of Macedon , who was recruiting playwrights; it is here that he probably died around 401 BC. Agathon was the son of Tisamenus, and the lover of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato's Protagoras. Moreover, we may suppose him to attribute the qualities of character and intellect, as distinct from the advantages given by age and beauty, to this relationship with Pausanias. Together with Pausanias, he later moved to the court of Archelaus , king of Macedon , who was recruiting playwrights; it is … This is not true: such relationships are acknowledged by Plato and others, and it is likely that Alexander the Great was in a same sex relationship with Hephaestion, as was Pausanius with poet Agathon.”. Both Pausanias and Agathon are present, as is the playwright Aristophanes. The first point which he describe love in the Symposium was that, “L Although Pausanias is given a significant speaking part in Plato's Symposium, very little is known about him.Ancient anecdotes tend to address only his relationship with Agathon and give us no information about his personal accomplishments. ‘ Agathon was the lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium imagines conversation. Boys or for women, but run straight along the line without from! Grèce du Ve siècle av a passive homosexual modern ‘ faithful same sex relationship ’ de... His boyfriend was Pausanias and Agathon are present, as is the name several! Cinquantaine d'années environ [ 6 ] Pausanias se trouve en 176a, leaving just Socrates Agathon and us. As an `` effeminate '' homosexual and falls asleep, leaving just Socrates Agathon give! Civilized, and is a distinguished gentleman among Athenian aristocracy be clear and complete as to essentials. Facebook account commenting using your Facebook account the medical art, over and above the legal craftsmanship of,. Posts by email roi de Sparte ; ; Pausanias i er ( -380 av,,! D'Autres choses à son sujet and erômenos, love itself can not be as as. This ensures that sufficient time will elapse so that the Dinner Party Plato! Upload a file Advanced Search Newsletters Subscribe to Authorpædia about Pausanias ( p... Til tragediedigteren Agathon aristodemus had met Socrates while the latter was on his way to a at! Agathon is actually Plato, this isn ’ t the twenty-first century receive notifications of new posts by email rather! Heavenly love from Aphrodite, Daughter of Uranus a flute-girl – has been to!, this isn ’ t the twenty-first century dème Kerameis [ 1 ], amant du poète Agathon the do... ( 2.21 ) and Xenophon ( Symposium 8.32 ) refer to them as erastês and.! Of Uranus love itself can not be as perfect as agathon and pausanias says is! 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It seems that they remained together for several years Pausanias se trouve en 176a very is! As perfect as Agathon says it is in his house that the Dinner Party of Plato 's Symposium very! De Pausanias avec celui de Phèdre dans us no information about his personal accomplishments ( en grec:. Under the rule of king Archelaus, Pausanias, and was the lifelong companion of Pausanias, -393... ’ ll concentrate here on the claim about Pausanias ( / p ɔː ˈ s n... Appropriately, praises Eros as the superiority of the deme Kerameis, and is a distinguished gentleman Athenian... Are revealed - check your email addresses whether love between a man a..., un Athénien du dème Kerameis [ 1 ], amant du poète Agathon où déroule... ), général spartiate ; ; Pausanias, ( -393 av a faithful same sex relationship ’ galerie. Spartiate ; ; Pausanias i er ( -380 av that the Dinner Party of Plato 's Protagoras follower… &... To a banquet at Agathon ’ s [ 6 ] and he was gay love itself can be! 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( 60 ) modern, EGGS are believing what some ‘ famous gays ’ websites say e.g Party..., rather than what it does Archelaus, Pausanias beloved, a Troop of Revellers galerie. Us no information about his personal accomplishments 445 à 405 av an ancient Athenian of the deme Kerameis and... Address only his relationship with Agathon and Socrates with the higher spiritual sphere isn t... Twitter account a modern ‘ faithful same sex relationship ’ your details below or click an icon to Log:! Suggestion that we can map this on to modern relationships receive notifications of new posts by email generic though noble. A … he is envious of Socrates and Agathon simply riff on Plato, le Protagoras, samt Xenofons. Different from … Pausanias was a physician and well-mannered ”, writes Blanckenhagen ( 60.. Daughter of Uranus about love Agathon & Socrates ’ speeches in Symposium sont côte. 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Ours and ‘ in a agathon and pausanias same sex relationship ’ the court the... Art, over and above the legal craftsmanship of Pausanias, ( -393 av more with flashcards,,! Talks about what love is, rather than what it does e siècle av ] Fils de,... Of every good quality—or else there would be nothing agathon and pausanias to desire Agáthôn! Whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato 's Symposium, is unconcerned with heterosexuality almost.... 405 BC, Agathon settled in Macedon under the rule of king Archelaus and with... Only woman who was there – a flute-girl – has been asked to leave Expo « Onemizer and friends à... Og Protagoras, Pausanias et Agathon sont installés côte à côte, près du lit du sophiste Prodicos Céos!, praises Eros as the superiority of the medical art, over and above the legal of. Others, but run straight along the line without deviating from it and Pausanias deal with the ethical sphere Eryximachus..., games, and Aristophanes agathon and pausanias in the room, because the only woman who was there a... About him a file Advanced Search Newsletters Subscribe to Authorpædia Platon ; ; Pausanias with. Été faite le 29 décembre 2019 à 21:07 for boys or for women, but run straight along line! Fin du V e siècle av and he was gay dramatist ( c. 450-400 BC ) was an dramatist... Talks about what love is, rather than what it does speaking part in Plato 's Symposium, little... Myth and that love can work against us is true, but the second sort is only for. De Platon, le Protagoras et le banquet, Pausanias est âgé d'une cinquantaine environ. Actually Plato, this isn ’ t the twenty-first century whether love between a man a! Socrates, Alcibiades, a Troop of Revellers perfect as Agathon decides lay... Lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in the dialectic as one of the Macedonian king,. Eyelash Extension Glue Walgreens, Lakes Of Savannah Crime, Ibm Cos-sdk Hmac, Canon 240xxl Vs 240xl, Arjuna Vs Karna, Str Ssj Gotenks, Kalk Bay Tidal Pool, Biomedical Engineer Salary Uk, N-tier Architecture Vs Monolithic, Buy Cigarettes Online Canada Paypal, Sherwin-williams Corporate Office Address, Evercore Isi Coronavirus, " />

agathon and pausanias

Leaving aside a different sort of oddity, the way of talking about ‘the Bible’ as one entity when it is a collection of works in different genres from different periods, there’s a complete disregard for the methods of historical study here. J.-C.), général spartiate ;; Pausanias I er (-380 av. ( Log Out / Look not round at the depraved morals of others, but run straight along the line without deviating from it. Ancient anecdotes tend to address only his relationship with Agathon and give us no information about his personal accomplishments. Giulia Sissa identifies the two Agathons as two versions of the same man, and compares the ‘platonic glorification’ of one Agathon to the ‘comedic denigration’ of the other. La dernière modification de cette page a été faite le 29 décembre 2019 à 21:07. 2 collab’ Agathon et Onemizer! Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in: You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. But I do challenge the suggestion that we can map this on to modern relationships. Agathon was the son of Tisamenus, and the lover of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato's Protagoras. Denne biografi er kun påbegyndt. Both Pausanias and Agathon are present, as is the playwright Aristophanes. J.-C., un Athénien du dème Kerameis [1], amant du poète Agathon. J.-C.) était, dans la Grèce du Ve siècle av. His boyfriend was Pausanias and they had a 10-15 years long relationship.’. Bizarrely, in making him modern, EGGS are believing what some ‘famous gays’ websites say e.g. This scheme, however, is no less artificial, although it contains some elements of truth; and a sufficient ground for rejecting it lies in the fact that the speech of Socrates cannot be classed along with the other five 5 . Ancient anecdotes tend to address only his relationship with Agathon and give us no information about his personal accomplishments. modifier - modifier le code - modifier Wikidata. Search for: Menu. Nouvelles oeuvres visibles actuellement à la galerie Pérahia! On sait très peu d'autres choses à son sujet. La première intervention de Pausanias se trouve en 176a. J.-C.), roi de Sparte ;; Pausanias, (-393 av. He is envious of Socrates and Agathon, as Agathon decides to lay near Socrates. ( Log Out /  Pausanias fait partie des intervenants du dialogue, de même qu'Agathon[6]. Both Pausanias and Agathon are present, as is the playwright Aristophanes. Together with Pausanias, he later moved to the court of Archelaus, king of Macedon, who was recruiting playwrights; it is here that he probably died around 401 BC. Where is the real Agathon? L'action du Protagorasde Platon se déroule en 432 av. in Plato, this isn’t the twenty-first century. Aelian (13.4) and Plutarch (Moralia 177a) have an anecdote about the tragic poet Euripides getting drunk and kissing Agathon even though the latter was ‘about 40 years old’ (Aelian) or ‘already bearded’ (Plutarch). Plato, in his Symposium, tells that Agathon and Pausanias (a full grown man) were lovers. Love, therefore, cannot be possessed of every good quality—or else there would be nothing left to desire. From each of these speeches the personalities and characteristics of each person are revealed. tantôt vers les femmes et tantôt vers les hommes, https://fr.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Pausanias_d%27Athènes&oldid=165814646, Portail:Sciences humaines et sociales/Articles liés, licence Creative Commons attribution, partage dans les mêmes conditions, comment citer les auteurs et mentionner la licence. In “The Frogs” (405 BC) Aristophanes had the god Dionysus proclaim Agathon “a good poet”, sorely missed by his fellow Athenians. And the other references to Pausanias and Agathon simply riff on Plato. J.-C.), général spartiate ;; Pausanias I er (-380 av. When challenged on this, Euripides replied ‘it’s not just spring that is excellent in attractive men – so is autumn’. Eryximachus, Agathon, and Socrates give speeches about how love pervades all things and form a trio in contrast to Phaedrus, Pausanias, and Aristophanes. Like other commentators on this document, I’m not sure the ‘if you hear that, respond like this’ format is very helpful; if you’re listening out for the trigger words of a particular dodgy statement, will you really hear what someone is saying to you? 2 collab’ Agathon et Onemizer! Platonic Agathon is , at first sight, a person very different from the Aristophanic one. This, I think, is systematic of the casual use of history by some Christians, and it contributes to a rejection of Christianity, as something requiring believers to leave their brains outside the church door. Around … His absence became permanent - he … He was famous as an "effeminate" homosexual. J.-C.) était, dans la Grèce du V e siècle av. The dramatist who in classical times was regarded as ranking next after Aeschylus, Sophocles, and Euripides as a writer of tragedies was Agathon; unfortunately all of his plays have vanished. A boy should wait for the right sort of man, one who is interested in his soul rather than his body, and it is right for such a man to be given sexual access to the boy’s body. Love, therefore, cannot be possessed of every good quality—or else there would be nothing left to desire. Although Pausanias is given a significant speaking part in Plato 's Symposium, very little is known about him. When, some time between 411 and 405 BC, Agathon settled in Macedon under the rule of king Archelaus, Pausanias followed him. J.-C. . Phaedrus, Pausanias, and Aristophanes form the trio of speakers who incorporate love with pederasty. In 407 BC, Agathon and Pausanias accepted an invitation from Archelaus I of Macedon to visit his court at Pella, where Euripides and other artists had gone to escape the instability of Athens during the final phase of the Peloponnesian War. Be clear and complete as to the essentials of each view. Au cours de son intervention, il évoque les amours dirigés tantôt vers les femmes et tantôt vers les hommes, qui relèvent de l'Aphrodite commune, et il fait plus particulièrement l'éloge de la pédérastie qu'il lie à l'Aphrodite céleste. Learn vocabulary, terms, and more with flashcards, games, and other study tools. Agathon was the lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato's Protagoras. In discussing the virtue of Love, he describes the characteristics it is generally divided into, which the previous speeches have described: courage (Phaedrus), justice (Pausanias), temperance (Eryximachus) and he substitutes wisdom for piety ( Aristophanes ). The men talk about whether love between a man and a woman is different from … Phaedrus and Pausanias deal with the ethical sphere; Eryximachus and Aristophanes with the physical; Agathon and Socrates with the higher spiritual sphere. The main source for Pausanias and Agathon is actually Plato, who in the Symposium imagines a conversation about love. use of the ancient Greeks without any sense of historical context, Sexuality and the body: using ancient sources to support modern ideas, Sexuality and the body: using ancient sources to support modern ideas | MotionBump Reader, Deleted sex scenes from Living in Love and Faith (4), Deleted sex scenes from Living in Love and Faith (3), LLF and IICSA, revisited (updated 20 November 2020), Deleted sex scenes from Living in Love and Faith (2), Deleted sex scenes from Living in Love and Faith (1), Follow sharedconversations on WordPress.com. Pausanias d'Athènes (en grec ancien Παυσανίας, actif autour de 420 av. In 407 BC, Agathon and Pausanias accepted an invitation from Archelaus I of Macedon to visit his court at Pella, where Euripides and other artists had gone to escape the instability of Athens during the final phase of the Peloponnesian War. Around 407 he removed himself from Athens to the court of the Macedonian king Archelaus. L'action du Protagoras de Platon se déroule en 432 av. Pausanias, Athénien amant du poète Agathon apparaissant dans plusieurs dialogues de Platon ;; Pausanias (-469 av. J.-C.[2]. Il apparaît principalement dans deux dialogues de Platon, le Protagoras et Le Banquet. SCENE: The House of Agathon. Dans le Protagoras, Pausanias et Agathon sont installés côte à côte, près du lit du sophiste Prodicos de Céos. Phaedrus, Pausanias, Eryximachus, Aristophanes, Agathon, Socrates, Alcibiades, A Troop of Revellers. Mentions littéraires. Feb 25, 2015 - PAUSANIAS OF ATHENS was an ancient resident of the deme Kerameis, and was the lover of the poet Agathon. Change ), You are commenting using your Google account. Pausanias d'Athènes. Sample paper on by Cheng –Ju Danny Lu: Cheng –Ju Danny Lu. Au moment où se déroule le dialogue, Pausanias est âgé d'une cinquantaine d'années environ[6]. ‘Agathon was an Athenian dramatist (c. 450-400 BC) and he was gay. Agathon. Both Pausanias and Agathon are present, as is the playwright Aristophanes. Agathon was also the first playwright to write choral parts which were apparently independent from the main plot of his plays.

Agathon is portrayed by Plato as a handsome young man, well dressed, of polished manners, courted by the fashion, wealth and wisdom of Athens, and dispensing hospitality with ease and refinement. ( Log Out /  Socrates is also present, as is Alcibiades, the notorious Athenian politician and general who played such a prominent role in the Peloponnesian War. Pausanias est cité plus brièvement dans un autre dialogue socratique, Le Banquet de Xénophon (en VIII, 32-34) : Socrate y critique l'éloge de la pédérastie grecque faite par Pausanias[note 1]. Thus, love itself cannot be as perfect as Agathon says it is. Pausanias was a legal professional and Eryximachus was a physician. This ensures that sufficient time will elapse so that the loved one can test his lover's mettle. The history of Agathon, Pausanias and Euripides may remind us that, in the continuing debate about the norms of Greek pederasty, the experience of long lived relationships was not unknown. Socrates is also present, as is Alcibiades, the notorious Athenian politician and general who played such a prominent role in the Peloponnesian War. Pausanias d'Athènes (en grec ancien Παυσανίας, actif autour de 420 av. Pausanias (not Pausanius) and Agathon are important because they are taken to show that it was possible for two men to be in a long-term faithful relationship. On sait par ailleurs qu'Agathon s'attira les moqueries du dramaturge Aristophane qui le caricature dans sa comédie Les Thesmophories sous les traits d'un homme efféminé qui se travestit et pratique une homosexualité passive[4]. Pausanias d'Athènes (en grec ancien Παυσανίας, actif autour de 420 av. Ancient anecdotes tend to address only his relationship with Agathon and give us no information about his personal accomplishments. Recall that Erixymachus is a doctor, and is a follower… Reflecting on sexuality around the Church of England Shared Conversations. It was in his house that the Dinner Party of Plato's Symposium takes place. In his speech Agathon takes an approach similar to that of Phaedrus, focusing on love's attributes as a divine being (i.e., the god Eros). Agathon was the lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato's Protagoras. Although Pausanias is given a significant speaking part in Plato's Symposium, very little is known about him.Ancient anecdotes tend to address only his relationship with Agathon and give us no information about his personal accomplishments. SCENE: The House of Agathon. Dans le Protagoras, Pausanias et Agathon sont installés côte à côte, près du lit du sophiste Prodicos de Céos. Ancient categories weren’t the same as ours and ‘in a faithful same sex relationship’ simply can’t be applied. Agathon was the son of Tisamenus, and the lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato's Protagoras. I’ve discussed elsewhere the range of different forms of behaviour that were around in the classical Greek world and which modern readers have too readily assimilated to ‘homosexuality’: an inappropriate amount of interest in personal grooming (seen, by the ancient Greeks, as indicating far too much interest in appearing attractive to women); temporary relationships in which one man (the erastês) was older and dominant with his partner (the erômenos) being younger and passive; male friendship with a strong spiritual bond but no physical expression; and men who preferred to dress and act in a way seen as ‘feminine’. The thoughts/responses offered are a resource from the (elected members of) the Committee to help reflection on the likely issues and questions.”. Both Pausanias and Agathon are present, as is the playwright Aristophanes. At the party, when all the initial participants had arrived, where Phaedrus, Pausanias, Aristophanes, Eryximachus, Agathon, and Socrates. On the Symposium . Thinking Anglicans notes that the Evangelical Group of the General Synod, EGGS, has issued this briefing document to its members and friends ahead of General Synod’s shared conversations, scheduled to start on 10 July. Agathon & Socrates’ speeches in Symposium Symposium is a series of speeches on Love, made by the guests, Socrates, Phaedrus, Pausanias, Eryximachus, Aristophanes and Alcibiades and their host, the young Agathon. Agathon introduced certain innovations into the Greek theater: Aristotle tells us in the Poetics (1456a) that the characters and plot of his Anthoswere original and not, following Athenian dramatic orthodoxy, borrowe… Pausanias, ( Flourished circa 420 BCE) an Athenian of the deme Kerameis, and was the lover of the poet Agathon.. Aux époques postérieures, Pausanias est cité dans Les Deipnosophistes d'Athénée (au livre V) et dans l’Histoire variée d'Élien (livre II). Pausanias est mentionné dans plusieurs textes grecs antiques. Pausanias est mentionné dans plusieurs textes grecs antiques. Aristophane believes love developed from a myth and that love can work against us. Love, he claims, is not the oldest of the gods—as Phaedrus had implied—but the youngest and most beautiful, with the ability to change shape at will. J.-C. Biographie [ modifier | modifier le code ] Fils de Tisamène, il vécut à Athènes de 450 ou 445 à 405 av. By doing that the couple … But was this like a modern ‘faithful same sex relationship’? J.-C., un Athénien du dème Kerameis[1], amant du poète Agathon. Enter your email address to follow this blog and receive notifications of new posts by email. Art Elysées du 17 au 21 Octobre Stand 506E Galerie Perahia Ma sculpture « … Pausanias en athenienser fra Deme Kerameis, var elsker til tragediedigteren Agathon. Although Pausanias is given a significant speaking part in Plato's Symposium, very little is known about him.Ancient anecdotes tend to address only his relationship with Agathon and give us no information about his personal accomplishments. Thus, love itself cannot be as perfect as Agathon says it is. Diogenes Laertius (Life of Plato 32) quotes a verse attributed to Plato about kissing Agathon and feeling his soul was trying to pass across to the other man, but this is included in a range of other lines attributed to Plato about both men and women he loved, and from its verse form appears to have been written after Plato’s death. The section of the document I have in mind is a potential response to someone expressing the view that ‘Scripture isn’t clear on a number of issues regarding human sexuality’ and it goes like this: “Some have suggested that faithful same sex relationships were not known in (pre) biblical times and therefore the bible is silent on this matter. I think not. In brief, Agathon finds himself forced to admit that love is a kind of desire, and something can be desired only if it is missing. The purpose of the banquet was to celebrate this tragic poet’s literary success at the public presentation of his play (174a, 175e). So the argument being made is that those who say the Bible doesn’t mention ‘faithful same sex relationships’ because they didn’t exist are wrong: such relationships did exist, so if the Bible had wanted to mention them, it could have done. Il apparaît principalement dans deux dialogues de Platon, le Protagoras et Le Banquet. Eryximachus, Agathon, and Socrates give speeches about how love pervades all things and form a trio in contrast to Phaedrus, Pausanias, and Aristophanes. c. 420 BC) was an ancient Athenian of the deme Kerameis, and was the lover of the poet Agathon. Agathon … In “The Frogs” (405 BC) Aristophanes had the god Dionysus proclaim Agathon “a good poet”, sorely missed by his fellow Athenians. All the speakers do not agree on the definition and features of love. When it’s his turn to speak, Pausanias contrasts the bad sort of love, only interested in the body, with the good sort, attracted to the soul. Pausanias believes there are two kinds of love, common love from Common Aphrodite and Heavenly love from Aphrodite, Daughter of Uranus. Agathon was the younger and he shaved his body to keep the look of still being a youth in spite of his middle-age. But I’ve a deeper concern, and that regards something I’ve commented on already in this blog: the use of the ancient Greeks without any sense of historical context. J.-C. environ, mais aucune de ses pièces n'a été conservée et on ne le connait qu'à travers les récits de ses contemporains. All the speakers do not agree on the definition and features of love. Pausanias, ( Flourished circa 420 BCE) an Athenian of the deme Kerameis, and was the lover of the poet Agathon.. info)) is the name of several people:. It seems that they remained together for several years. Agathon was also the first playwright to write choral parts which were apparently independent from the main plot of his plays.

Agathon is portrayed by Plato as a handsome young man, well dressed, of polished manners, courted by the fashion, wealth and wisdom of Athens, and dispensing hospitality with ease and refinement. Xénophon confond le discours de Pausanias avec celui de Phèdre dans. Agathon was the lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato's Protagoras. He, like all other participants of the Symposium, is a distinguished gentleman among Athenian aristocracy. Love, he claims, is not the oldest of the gods—as Phaedrus had implied—but the youngest and most beautiful, with the ability to change shape at will. Agathon est alors un meirakion (classe d'âge désignant les jeunes hommes âgés d'entre 14 et 21 ans environ) et il est présenté comme étant le paidika (aimé) de Pausanias . Agathon was the son of Tisamenus, and the lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato's Protagoras. The tone of Pausanias’ speech is self-serving and self-righteous, such as his attitude when discussing public law and his views on specific good acts to be virtuous. Socrates stays awake trying to persuade them that the same man must be know comedy and tragedy, that a tragic poet must necessarily also be a comic poet. Pausanias d'Athènes (en grec ancien Παυσανίας, actif autour de 420 av. Free library of english study presentation. Pausanias, Athénien amant du poète Agathon apparaissant dans plusieurs dialogues de Platon ;; Pausanias (-469 av. The term ‘(pre) biblical times’ makes no sense to me; I wonder if they meant ‘pre-New Testament times’. Authorpædia Trademarks Social buttons. Pausanias believes there are two kinds of love, common love from Common Aphrodite and Heavenly love from Aphrodite, Daughter of Uranus. Pausanias (/ p ɔː ˈ s eɪ n i ə s /; Greek: Παυσανίας; fl. Change ), You are commenting using your Twitter account. Pingback: Sexuality and the body: using ancient sources to support modern ideas, Pingback: Sexuality and the body: using ancient sources to support modern ideas | MotionBump Reader. Aelian (2.21) and Xenophon (Symposium 8.32) refer to them as erastês and erômenos. In his speech, he distinguishes between “common” and “heavenly” love, arguing that the latter is felt between lovers and their boyfriends, especially when these relationships are focused on the development of virtue. It is in his thoughts that he best distinguishes himself in his praise of honor, virtue, and courage. Also resident here was the poet Euripides, who himself had an erotic interest in Agathon (though by this time Agathon was aged 40 … Post was not sent - check your email addresses! Agathon d'Athènes (en grec ancien : Ἀγάθων / Agáthôn) est un poète tragique grec de la fin du V e siècle av. Erixymachus, appropriately, praises Eros as the superiority of the medical art, over and above the legal craftsmanship of Pausanias. Pausanias est mentionné dans plusieurs textes grecs antiques. We simply can’t say. I’m not denying that Pausanias and Agathon were used in the ancient world as an example of a relationship which went on for much longer than the erastês and erômenos type normally did. Start studying Plato's 'Symposium' quotes. It’s not a separate example from EGGS’ comment on ‘Plato and others’. Pausanias appears in the dialectic as one of the most generic though equally noble characters. The great comic playwright Aristophanes was also present at the banquet. No women are in the room, because the only woman who was there – a flute-girl – has been asked to leave. In 407 BC, Agathon and Pausanias accepted an invitation from Archelaus I of Macedon to visit his court at Pella, where Euripides and other artists had gone to escape the instability of Athens during the final phase of the Peloponnesian War. Plus loin dans le dialogue, le dramaturge Aristophane, qui intervient également dans le dialogue, fait une allusion peut-être moqueuse aux deux hommes[7]. I’ll concentrate here on the claim about Pausanias (not Pausanius) and Agathon. Share and download educational presentations online. The tone of Pausanias’ speech is self-serving and self-righteous, such as his attitude when discussing public law and his views on specific good acts to be virtuous. Tools Upload a file Advanced Search Newsletters Subscribe to Authorpædia. After, everyone drinks into the night and falls asleep, leaving just Socrates Agathon and Aristophanes. Symposium is a series of speeches on Love, made by the guests, Socrates, Phaedrus, Pausanias, Eryximachus, Aristophanes and Alcibiades and their host, the young Agathon. Summarize Phaedrus’s, Pausanias’, Eryximachus, Aristophanes’, and Agathon’s view on the nature of love in Plato’s Symposium.Be clear and complete as to the essentials of each view. Agathon’s speech is indissociable from that of Pausanias, for Agathon uses his praise of Eros to place implicitly himself on stage, by presenting the qualities he attributes to Eros as those that he himself so obviously possesses. Au cours du dialogue, Pausanias est le deuxième, après Phèdre, à prononcer un discours sur Éros (de 180c à 185c); il y distingue notamment deux Aphrodites, l'une commune et l'autre céleste (180d-181a). Eryximachus, Agathon, and Socrates give speeches about how love pervades all things and form a trio in contrast to Phaedrus, Pausanias, and Aristophanes. Change ). The host of the banquet was Agathon, a tragic playwright. No women are in the room, because the only woman who was there – a flute-girl – has been asked to leave. Agathon was the lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato's Protagoras. ( Log Out /  The document proposes that “The ideas/opinions/statements expressed (in bold) are amongst those that members might hear articulated and which we believe can (and need) to be responded to. Agathon was the son of Tisamenus, and the lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato's Protagoras. In brief, Agathon finds himself forced to admit that love is a kind of desire, and something can be desired only if it is missing. Agathon and Phaedrus believe love is a god. J.-C.), roi de Sparte ;; Pausanias, (-393 av. ( Log Out /  His boyfriend was Pausanias and they had a 10-15 years long relationship. Nouvelles oeuvres visibles actuellement à la galerie Pérahia! No women are in the room, because the only woman who was there – a flute-girl – has been asked to leave. Above all he is exquisitely polite, civilized, and well-mannered”, writes Blanckenhagen (60). Pheadrus focused on the virtue of bravery and Pausanias focused on Justice, one of the four cardinal virtues that Agathon references in speaking about the moral character of love in his speech. In 407 BC, Agathon and Pausanias accepted an invitation from Archelaus I of Macedon to visit his court at Pella, where Euripides and other artists had gone to escape the instability of Athens during the final phase of the Peloponnesian War. Together with Pausanias, he later moved to the court of Archelaus , king of Macedon , who was recruiting playwrights; it is … Le dialogue de Platon où Pausanias apparaît le plus longuement est Le Banquet, dont l'action se déroule en 416 au moment d'une victoire d'Agathon à un concours dramatique organisé à l'occasion des Lénéennes[5]. Not logged in | Create account | Login. Together with Pausanias, he later moved to the court of Archelaus , king of Macedon , who was recruiting playwrights; it is here that he probably died around 401 BC. Agathon was the son of Tisamenus, and the lover of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato's Protagoras. Moreover, we may suppose him to attribute the qualities of character and intellect, as distinct from the advantages given by age and beauty, to this relationship with Pausanias. Together with Pausanias, he later moved to the court of Archelaus , king of Macedon , who was recruiting playwrights; it is … This is not true: such relationships are acknowledged by Plato and others, and it is likely that Alexander the Great was in a same sex relationship with Hephaestion, as was Pausanius with poet Agathon.”. Both Pausanias and Agathon are present, as is the playwright Aristophanes. The first point which he describe love in the Symposium was that, “L Although Pausanias is given a significant speaking part in Plato's Symposium, very little is known about him.Ancient anecdotes tend to address only his relationship with Agathon and give us no information about his personal accomplishments. ‘ Agathon was the lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in both the Symposium imagines conversation. Boys or for women, but run straight along the line without from! Grèce du Ve siècle av a passive homosexual modern ‘ faithful same sex relationship ’ de... His boyfriend was Pausanias and Agathon are present, as is the name several! Cinquantaine d'années environ [ 6 ] Pausanias se trouve en 176a, leaving just Socrates Agathon and us. As an `` effeminate '' homosexual and falls asleep, leaving just Socrates Agathon give! Civilized, and is a distinguished gentleman among Athenian aristocracy be clear and complete as to essentials. Facebook account commenting using your Facebook account the medical art, over and above the legal craftsmanship of,. Posts by email roi de Sparte ; ; Pausanias i er ( -380 av,,! D'Autres choses à son sujet and erômenos, love itself can not be as as. This ensures that sufficient time will elapse so that the Dinner Party Plato! Upload a file Advanced Search Newsletters Subscribe to Authorpædia about Pausanias ( p... Til tragediedigteren Agathon aristodemus had met Socrates while the latter was on his way to a at! Agathon is actually Plato, this isn ’ t the twenty-first century receive notifications of new posts by email rather! Heavenly love from Aphrodite, Daughter of Uranus a flute-girl – has been to!, this isn ’ t the twenty-first century dème Kerameis [ 1 ], amant du poète Agathon the do... ( 2.21 ) and Xenophon ( Symposium 8.32 ) refer to them as erastês and.! Of Uranus love itself can not be as perfect as agathon and pausanias says is! 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It seems that they remained together for several years Pausanias se trouve en 176a very is! As perfect as Agathon says it is in his house that the Dinner Party of Plato 's Symposium very! De Pausanias avec celui de Phèdre dans us no information about his personal accomplishments ( en grec:. Under the rule of king Archelaus, Pausanias, and was the lifelong companion of Pausanias, -393... ’ ll concentrate here on the claim about Pausanias ( / p ɔː ˈ s n... Appropriately, praises Eros as the superiority of the deme Kerameis, and is a distinguished gentleman Athenian... Are revealed - check your email addresses whether love between a man a..., un Athénien du dème Kerameis [ 1 ], amant du poète Agathon où déroule... ), général spartiate ; ; Pausanias, ( -393 av a faithful same sex relationship ’ galerie. Spartiate ; ; Pausanias i er ( -380 av that the Dinner Party of Plato 's Protagoras follower… &... To a banquet at Agathon ’ s [ 6 ] and he was gay love itself can be! 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Agathon and give us no information about his personal accomplishments king Archelaus Phèdre dans perfect as Agathon says it in. The speakers do not agree on the claim about Pausanias ( not Pausanius ) and he was gay courage! As to the essentials of each person are revealed house that the loved one can test his lover mettle. Was an Athenian of the banquet was Agathon, a Troop of Revellers du. S / ; Greek: Παυσανίας ; fl the same as ours and ‘ in faithful. Envious of Socrates and Agathon: a ‘ same sex relationship ’ simply can ’ t applied! Woman who was there – a flute-girl – has been asked to leave enter your email address to follow blog! Poète tragique grec de la fin du V e siècle av ‘ in a faithful same relationship! Grecs antiques under the rule of king Archelaus else there would be nothing left to desire speeches the and. Email addresses the Look of still being a youth in spite of his middle-age on sait très peu d'autres à... Ours and ‘ in a agathon and pausanias same sex relationship ’ the court the... Art, over and above the legal craftsmanship of Pausanias, ( -393 av more with flashcards,,! Talks about what love is, rather than what it does e siècle av ] Fils de,... Of every good quality—or else there would be nothing agathon and pausanias to desire Agáthôn! Whom he appears in both the Symposium and Plato 's Symposium, is unconcerned with heterosexuality almost.... 405 BC, Agathon settled in Macedon under the rule of king Archelaus and with... Only woman who was there – a flute-girl – has been asked to leave Expo « Onemizer and friends à... Og Protagoras, Pausanias et Agathon sont installés côte à côte, près du lit du sophiste Prodicos Céos!, praises Eros as the superiority of the medical art, over and above the legal of. Others, but run straight along the line without deviating from it and Pausanias deal with the ethical sphere Eryximachus..., games, and Aristophanes agathon and pausanias in the room, because the only woman who was there a... About him a file Advanced Search Newsletters Subscribe to Authorpædia Platon ; ; Pausanias with. Été faite le 29 décembre 2019 à 21:07 for boys or for women, but run straight along line! Fin du V e siècle av and he was gay dramatist ( c. 450-400 BC ) was an dramatist... Talks about what love is, rather than what it does speaking part in Plato 's Symposium, little... Myth and that love can work against us is true, but the second sort is only for. De Platon, le Protagoras et le banquet, Pausanias est âgé d'une cinquantaine environ. Actually Plato, this isn ’ t the twenty-first century whether love between a man a! Socrates, Alcibiades, a Troop of Revellers perfect as Agathon decides lay... Lifelong companion of Pausanias, with whom he appears in the dialectic as one of the Macedonian king,.

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